Dear Lil'kc and Ken,
Thanks for the time you spent at my place the Sunday before last. I found it both interesting and educational when you demonstrated your approach, or probably more appropriately called your 'philosophy' to sound, in the span of 4 hours or so.
I have taken the last couple of weeks to get a better handle on the sound changes in my system from the 'torquing' you have done on my equipment. I have also been thinking through this experience. I like to share with you my understanding, and please give me your feedback, especially if I have missed out something or have not been correct.
I understand that you aim for a number of key sound characteristics. I identified these as openness & clarity, extended frequency response at both ends, dynamism, and liveliness. This seems to be taken as an 'absolute' reference. I got this when on a couple of occasions lil'kc mentioned about his 'C', which is what he used to call his sound quality target. He used 'C' in contrast with 'A-B', that is that you are not evaluating sound quality through relative comparison (i.e., A-B'ing equipment's performance) but against a fixed standard instead. Am I right? (lil'kc talked about 'C' quite regularly on his blog, I could not understand it till now!) :-)
Since you have this clear target, everything done is aimed directly at its achievement. This was demonstrated in your visit session. The tightening of the screws on the equipment using a torque driver seems to 'liberate' the sound (well, 'tightening' is a misnomer, in fact, the torqued screws are looser than the original tightness that the equipment came with, but now every screw has the same tightness). As the 'torquing' exercise moved upstream, first the loudspeakers, then the amp, then the cdp, openness and dynamism of the sound improved. Then, step by step, a Telos powercord was added to the cdp, existing tweaks were taken off one by one, and tweaks from Telos were added, such as XLR caps, RCA caps and the loudspeakers banana caps. At each step, listening is conducted and the step will be reversed if the change was deemed to have gone overboard from the sound target.
Telos XLR male caps. Female version also availableSlowly but surely, the sound quality edged towards those sound targets mentioned earlier. The volume control edged up too, music was played louder and louder, adding greater dynamics, clarity and excitement to the listening experience.
Honestly, I have never listened to music on my system at such loudness level. Usually I would have found it a little painful aurally at levels like this, but now, the sound was composed and smooth.
The character, dynamic swing and the volume of the sound reminded me a lot about 'Live Sound'. I think I am not wrong to say that your 'C' is actually about that - LIVE.
Telos RCA capsSwapping tweaks with those from Telos showed that they are pulling in different directions. My existing tweaks seems to work by 'covering up flaws', such as improving smoothness by turn down slightly the upper mids and the highs. However, Telos' pulled the other way, they aim to take the sound already liberated by torquing and expand it even further.
Am I right to say that torquing is the pre-requisite for the use of Telos' tweaks? I could imagine that without torquing, the addition of Telos' caps would not have given the users the full benefits, if at all. If so, then Telos dealers must educate their customers accordingly and probably even perform such a service for them.
Telos' products also seem to give the max effect when they are used as a total solution, as was heard as more and more Telos products were added. Mixing it with other brands again may restrict their full potential. So I think prospective users should be ready to go the whole length eventually.
Telos banana caps for speaker terminalsKen has been advocating that all tweaks should be re-evaluated after torquing, he is right. I like to bring this one step further - every time a change is made in your system (e.g., adding a new piece of equipment), all tweaks should in fact be re-evaluated. Because if the tweaks do the 'cover-up flaws' thing, as I understand that some do from this experience, and the new change takes away the flaw, leaving the tweak in actually would restrict your system's performance. Not sure if you agree with this tweak novice. :-)
Anyway, I am interested to check out further the efficacy of Telos' tweaks, starting with the caps, as they aren't really expensive. I really must go and get some review samples. :-)
After you left and took away with you all the Telos items, I listened to my system for a few more days. The effects from the torquing were still there, but the performance was different from that during your visit session. I now look forward to do a longer term evaluation of Telos' products.
As it is, the system still sounds pretty good, with just the torquing effects left - 'Live-like', not your full 'C', but a few steps closer. :-)
Yours,
Hifikaki
27 comments:
Hifikaki,
First of all, KC and I would like to thank you for accommodating us for 4 hours.
In terms of torquing, I would say that KC is much more experienced than me. But I would try to explain all that I have learned from him.
As I have stated this in the past in this blogsite, if you are embarking on torquing tweak,
1. you have to do it step by step.
You cannot torque one hardware and then, another hardware that takes your fancy. If you do this step by step, you can appreciate the improvement much easier.
2. you cannot torque all hardware at the same tightness. Some hardware have to be tighten at higher torque, some lower. It really depends on the fragility of the hardware.
3. almost all hardware, racks etc can be torqued. This includes conditioners, plug points, etc. Practically anything that has screws can be torqued. But I would advise against torquing circuit board or the internals of the hardware, unless you really know what you are doing. The reason is that these parts are much more fragile.
4. be prepared to retweak your system again after torquing. The reason is after torquing, you will hear all the disadvantages that is inherent of your system. For example, sometimes you will hear that the highs is still not extended enough, this could be due to room tunes, curtains, caps, cones etc. In your case, it was the front and side curtains and RF insulators.
When you remove them, you found that the sound becomes more coherent, extended etc.
So I would advise to check all your tweaks. Remove them all if you can. Then add them back one by one to hear the differences. I find most tweaks tend to truncate the highs or muddle the sound but I wouldn't have known this if I have not had my system torqued.
I have explained all of this when ML raise this issue in this blog in the past. I agree that all system sounds different but I find that torquing always produce the same result, whether you use tubes, ss, box speakers etc.
After you have torqued and retweak your system, then you can add Telos products to your system one by one. You will hear the benefits of Telos products in your hardware even if you didn't torque your system. But you will benefit more if you had them torqued beforehand.
for your case, I would advise you to try the Telos XLR and RCA caps to cover every input and output. The are 2 versions, one is gold and the other platinum. Gold caps are more forgiving while Platinum will reveal all the deficiencies in a system. But in return, Platinum will reward the system with better highs and lower noise floor.
Then you could try the Telos Golden Reference power cord. I suggest that you try it with the source first. Then you can get another pair for the preamp, power amp etc.
With these cords, you will notice that the noise floor goes much lower. The system also gain in strength and control. That is why you find that you could listen to louder volumes without strain when we hook the pwr cord to your Meridian player. But you do not lose anything in terms of emotional content of the music.
To be frank, I was surprised at the volumes we were playing Stimela considering your Pass amps is only 60w. I shudder to think what would happen if we hooked the pwr cord to yr amps.
If you are adventurous enough, you can try the Telos Golden Reference interconnects later.
I am using almost all Telos products (3 prs of pwr cords, 1 pr interconnects, 1 pr speaker cable, countless xlr and rca caps). The only remaining cable is my ever reliable AQ Amazon which I retained. The sound I get now has improved and I can hear the emotional content, soundstage depth etc just like a "live" event (the band is in the room).
Although Telos uses copper for it's cables, you will not hear the usual "copper sound". In fact, you will hear more of a "silver sound".
Try it and tell me what you hear.
Ken,
Thank you yet again for your sharing on torquing and Telos product experience.
One thing that I failed to mention was that in my subsequent listening sessions, with the curtains at the sides and at the front wall fully drawn open, I got some listening fatigue after about an hour or so. So, they are now back to their original positions, though the ones on the front wall are left open at the middle with a 40-50cm gap, as per your suggestion on your first visit. That retains the lively feel and gives a better focus to the centre image
I could think of 2 possibilities for this:
1. The highs indeed got slightly too bright and 'hairy'/gritty with the curtains drawn. I did not detect this during your visit probably because we did not listened to music in a continuous 1 hour+ session, but test listened to a few tracks at a time.
or
2. This effect came about because the Telos products are not in the system anymore, and the balance got out of whack.
I can't be sure of either until I live with Telos for longer term. Sure need to go get those review samples. :-)
Thanks for your suggestions again, I'll proceed as suggested and share the experience.
Hifikaki,
It's a pleasure sharing experiences abt torquing.
Hifi can be a lonely hobby at times but if you share yr experiences abt things you have learned, it can be a very enjoyable hobby. Pity all audiophiles I met are men, not women;-(
In yr blog, you mentioned that the tweaks you are using are covering the flaws. It is not so. What is happening is that the tweak has improved one thing but make a few other things worse. And torquing yr setup has instantly revealed all these flaws.
That is why I repeatedly told everyone that you cannot stop after torquing yr setup. The reason is that there are some aspects of the system that is "blocking" the system's ability to sound even better. I am not saying that torquing would make a RM20K setup to sound like RM100K. But torquing would enhance the ability of a RM20K setup to rival a decently setup RM100K system.
So you have to "retweak" yr setup after torquing. The easiest way is to remove all existing tweaks and then add them back one by one. It is painstaking and laborious but that would enhance yr system by a few notches because from here, you can listen to "signature sound" of each tweak.
I used loads of tweaks in my setup. Now I have removed quite a few of them. By doing this, I find the system is free of all the shackles that has been suffocating it. It's easy to introduce a tweak and then hear the good thing abt it. What sometimes escape our attention is that the bad things that the tweak brings. So instead of doing A-B comparison, we try to get the C sound, the live sound. This way we can be sure that the tweak we use is pushing the system to another level and also giving us more bang for the buck.
Happy experimenting the Telos stuff.
Er.....how can you be sure that the "C" or "the live sound" that you believe is , is ready "the live sound" and not Telos tweak's "signature sound"??
and if take out the other tweak make the high more extend , how you can be sure that its not the Torque tweak that weaken the high??
No offend taken, but seeing claim like other tweak "has improved one thing but make a few other things worse",make me feel real uncomfortable, you mean all other manufacturer don't know about getting good sound and only Telos know how??
Er.....how can you be sure that the "C" or "the live sound" that you believe is , is ready "the live sound" and not Telos tweak's "signature sound"??
and if take out the other tweak make the high more extend , how you can be sure that its not the Torque tweak that weaken the high??
No offend taken, but seeing claim like other tweak "has improved one thing but make a few other things worse",make me feel real uncomfortable, you mean all other manufacturer don't know about getting good sound and only Telos know how??
after torqueing, any product should sound better and not just telos!
But Ken and Lil'kc (in his blog) comment have make it sound like after Torque , you only should use Telos product for 100% improvement , unlike other tweak will "improved one thing but make a few other things worse".
Are they related to Telos distribution in Malaysia? So hifikaki open letter purpose is a way to ask them borrow him the Telos cable?(Review sample!)
LOL!
Hi All Anons,
First of all, I don't know why some people have to remain anonymous to ask questions. Can you at least put yr name or you are too shy?;-P
1. How can you be sure that the "C" or "the live sound" that you believe is , is ready "the live sound" and not Telos tweak's "signature sound"??
-Simple, just attend as many live concerts as possible. Some live performances hv poor acoustic treatment, some hv good ones. Listen to the good ones. Then use them as a guide!!!
2.after torqueing, any product should sound better and not just telos!
-Yes, if the torquing is done correctly, the system should sound better. Hifikaki can attest to that. If you read my post, you will know that not all hardware is tighten at the same torque. Some are tighten at higher torque, some lower. I also told you that you have to torqued yr gear step by step to listen to change of sound. When we torqued, we haven't add any Telos product in yet, so the improvement of sound could not be due to Telos! Just ask Hifikaki!
3.But Ken and Lil'kc (in his blog) comment have make it sound like after Torque , you only should use Telos product for 100% improvement , unlike other tweak will "improved one thing but make a few other things worse".
-I don't understand how my words can be twisted so wrongly. I stated that "After you have torqued and retweak your system, then you can add Telos products to your system one by one. You will hear the benefits of Telos products in your hardware even if you didn't torque your system. But you will benefit more if you had them torqued beforehand".
So this means that you can hear Telos benefits even if you had not torqued yr system. Because you hv torqued yr system, then you will hear the benefits easier.
After you hv torqued yr system, it would have attained another level of performance. Because of the improvement, you can easily hear the strength and weakness of a new tweak. That is why I find some tweaks improve the sound in one aspect but weaken some other aspect of the sound.
4.Are they related to Telos distribution in Malaysia? So hifikaki open letter purpose is a way to ask them borrow him the Telos cable?(Review sample!)
-Again, some people can have such wild imaginations to come up with this. KC and I went to listen to Hifikaki's setup. He allowed us to torque his system because he believe we can improve it. From his open letter, you can see that we have done so because he is happy with the sound. Adding some Telos products has enhanced the sound even better. Without the Telos products, he can still hear the benefits of torquing but he find that his system cannot give him the level of performance as when we added Telos products. That is why Hifikaki is looking to review the Telos, simply because he has hear the differences.
We are not related to Telos and I do not gain any financial benefit of recommending Telos product. If Panzer advocate Torus conditioner, would we say that AV Design gave him some money to say good things abt it. If ML says Stage III sounds brilliant, should I say that Stage III hv him on the payroll? If a Stereophile or Absolute Sound reviewer says a hardware or cable is great sounding, do we say that he is on the take?
This blog is to update people of hifi components, tweaks etc. I know of a good tweak which the torque the hardware. When I share with everyone here, why do some people always think I have ulterior motive? If you do not believe, don't try it. YMMV!!!!!
Anonymous of 12.06PM
I don't know if li'kc and Ken can provide me with review samples, I don't think so. And if I want to borrow their cables, I'll ask directly, I do not need to write an article first.
I am Anonymous No.1. , my name is not important but you can call me No.1 if you think it's important.
"Simple, just attend as many live concerts as possible. Some live performances hv poor acoustic treatment, some hv good ones. Listen to the good ones. Then use them as a guide!!!"
So you mean all CD should sound like the "good" live concert that you have attended?
If system the playback don't sound like those "good" live concert in you impression, that mean the system sound is "wrong"?
But how you know that CD is recorded in the way you think it should be?
Also you have not reply my question : "and if take out the other tweak make the high more extend , how you can be sure that its not the Torque tweak that weaken the high??"
-- Also you have not reply my question : "and if take out the other tweak make the high more extend , how you can be sure that its not the Torque tweak that weaken the high??"
If you are around during the torquing session, you will notice that after the torque, the highs become more extended. If you remove the other detrimental tweaks, you will notice even better extension at both ends.
Due to my heavy schedule, I have been trying to reply to hifikaki in my best knowledge. But it was already 4 days ago since Ken pointed me to hifikaki's post. Shame on me.
Please bear with me, a reply is definitely in the pipeline.
Anon No 1,
1."So you mean all CD should sound like the "good" live concert that you have attended?"
-All well recorded cds should sound close to a good live concert. Do you have good sounding cds? Listen to them. Then listen to the cd in a better system esp those revealing dynamic systems. Listen to the differences between yr system and that system.
2."If system the playback don't sound like those "good" live concert in you impression, that mean the system sound is "wrong"?
-Did I say that in my posts? If your system is incapable of giving you a "good live performance", then you have not maximise it or in another way, it is incapable of doing so!
3."But how you know that CD is recorded in the way you think it should be?"
-Who would ever know? Probably a recording engineer would be the only who knows. But if you have been to good concerts whether it is a classical one or small jazz club, you will have absorb all the ambience, atmosphere and use them as a guide for your system.
4."Also you have not reply my question : "and if take out the other tweak make the high more extend , how you can be sure that its not the Torque tweak that weaken the high??"
-I am trying my best in my replying to so many Anons. I didn't know that audiophiles are such a shy lot. Anyway, I think I can be excused of not being able to answer 1 question, right?
KC has also answered yr question. To answer yr question, we torqued each gear one by one (read my post again and if you still don't understand, read it again). We listen to the system after we torqued each hardware. We want to hear what differences the torquing tweak has wrought. If torquing has reduced the highs, we would have known instantly. You can ask Hifikaki if torquing has actually truncate the highs in his system. It certainly did not do so in mine. In fact the highs and lows has gain in presence after KC has torqued my system.
So are there are any other questions you may like to raise?
Hifikaki,
You can call John Sin of C&O Audiophile, Msia Telos distributor if you are interested in trying out Telos products. ML has his contact number.
If you are trying Telos stuff, I would advise you to try out the accessories first like RCA and XLR caps. Then try the Telos Golden Reference power cord to yr source. If you are adventurous, then try the power cords to the pre and pwr amp. Then try out the XLR i/cs.
You can read my write-up on Telos at the following website
http://lilkcaudioblog.blogspot.com/2009/04/ken-telos.html
to understand what I hv been going through.
"If you are around during the torquing session, you will notice that after the torque, the highs become more extended. If you remove the other detrimental tweaks, you will notice even better extension at both ends."
Ok , I see, so the torque can make the system sound brighter, and the Telos cable and cap will warmer the sound, that why hifikaki need to pull back the curtain after the Telos cable is not in his system.
Anonymous no.1.
Dear Ken
-All well recorded cds should sound close to a good live concert. Do you have good sounding cds? Listen to them. Then listen to the cd in a better system esp those revealing dynamic systems. Listen to the differences between yr system and that system.--
If all well recorded cds should sound close to each other("good live concert" in your words) that that system is in serious trouble liao.
We all know that a good system should sound different with different cds, even well recorded live we should have different ambience and atmosphere, and there are also well recorded studio recording to listen and it should not should like in live concert that you attended.
If you think it's ok that all cds sound close to each other, than like what Lil'kc comment those who listen differently in his blog.
"如果閣下聽了不喜歡，可能閣下鍾情於失真音染多於音準了... "
to be continues
Anon no.1
"-Did I say that in my posts? If your system is incapable of giving you a "good live performance", then you have not maximise it or in another way, it is incapable of doing so!"
I was asking "If system playback don't sound like those "good" live concert in you impression, that mean the system sound is "wrong"? " because you keep emphasis we should use "live performance" as reference, so to us it seem like system that not close to your "live performance" experiences is incorrect.
"-Who would ever know? Probably a recording engineer would be the only who knows. But if you have been to good concerts whether it is a classical one or small jazz club, you will have absorb all the ambience, atmosphere and use them as a guide for your system."
but, do you know how much different is New york Carnegie Hall,Boston Symphony Hall,Vienna Musikverein hall,Berlin Berliner Philharmonie, Petronas Concert Hall, Singapore Esplanade??? And what about Pop and Rock concert that have totally different ambient and atmosphere??
Anonymous no.1
ignore 2nd reply above, lot of Typo.
Correction
Dear Ken
-All well recorded cds should sound close to a good live concert. Do you have good sounding cds? Listen to them. Then listen to the cd in a better system esp those revealing dynamic systems. Listen to the differences between yr system and that system.--
If all well recorded cds sound close to each other ("good live concert" in your words) than that system is in serious trouble liao.
We all know that a good system should sound different with different cds, even a well recorded live performance we should get different ambient and atmosphere for the system,some good some not so good; and there are also well recorded studio recording to listen and those cds should not should like in live concert (that you attended.).
If you think it's ok that all cds sound alike and close to each other, than like what Lil'kc comment to those who listen differently to him in his blog.
"如果閣下聽了不喜歡，可能閣下鍾情於失真音染多於音準了... "
Anonymous No.1
"To answer yr question, we torqued each gear one by one (read my post again and if you still don't understand, read it again). We listen to the system after we torqued each hardware. We want to hear what differences the torquing tweak has wrought. If torquing has reduced the highs, we would have known instantly. You can ask Hifikaki if torquing has actually truncate the highs in his system. It certainly did not do so in mine. In fact the highs and lows has gain in presence after KC has torqued my system."
So to me the torque tweak just another method to tweak the tonal balance and dynamic of the system to the level that to your guys like; it is another method of "voicing" the system, not exactly to "maximise" the system like you guys keep telling us.
Anonymous No.1
Hi Anon1,
Can I come to your place and demo it to you personally?
Anonymous no 1
i think the explanations of the benefit of torquing is simple enought;resonance control.
i use a lot of Finite Elemente stuff that control the resonance well and could see a similar benefits in torquing.
I also feel that Ken's explanations to be very precise .
"i think the explanations of the benefit of torquing is simple enought;resonance control."
Hifikaki, I totally agree with you, even not using Torque screwdriver,just loosen the screw of the equipment we can make the tonal balance shift to warmer region,because the resonance frequency of the equipment is lower and it added into the music, and most audiophile will like that.
It is nothing new if you have been in the Hi-Fi hobby long enough, check out those Hong Kong audiophile magazine 20/30 years ago they have lot of other tweaking method to play with resonance.
Using torque screwdriver will make the resonance more concentrated within a narrower frequency range, with usually is a good thing, but telling us torquing will "maximise the performance of a system??" come more lah, its only one of the countless voicing method in my humble opinion, particularly if the equipment have USED FOR SOMETIME.
Anonymous 1
"Hi Anon1,
Can I come to your place and demo it to you personally?"
Thank you for your offer, I have heard some of the systems Torque by Jeff Lim already, and I have to say the improvement is obvious.
What I disagree is the way you guys describe the tweak, make us feel like its the only ultimate tweak in audiophile circle, no other tweak can compare to it, and all other tweak have to look upon it, only tweak that match with the sound after Torque is good product/method.
I hope while promoting your tweaking method, please respect other tweaking theory and method at the same time.
Not only Telos guys know how to listen and what is good sound, everyone listen HiFi differently, and for this tweaking thing ,every road is leading to Rome.
Cheer!
Anonymous No.1
Since there are mentions of my system's highs - just for the record, the highs in my system became more extended during this exercise.
It is this change that made me say what I said about my tweaks (generic and shrting caps) in the write-up.
Anon No.1,
"Ok , I see, so the torque can make the system sound brighter, and the Telos cable and cap will warmer the sound, that why hifikaki need to pull back the curtain after the Telos cable is not in his system."
-If torquing just makes the sound go brighter, why does the bass in my system improve in heft as well after torquing? If the sound just goes brighter, why can we play louder without strain in Hifikaki's setup?
"If all well recorded cds should sound close to each other("good live concert" in your words) that that system is in serious trouble liao."
-So what is the trouble? Are you saying that the Eagle's Hell Freezes Over and Krall's Live In Paris is distorted in real live but corrected when they were mixed in the cd?
"If you think it's ok that all cds sound close to each other, than like what Lil'kc comment those who listen differently in his blog."
-I am chinese illiterate. His comments may have been done because of the situation.
"I was asking "If system playback don't sound like those "good" live concert in you impression, that mean the system sound is "wrong"? " because you keep emphasis we should use "live performance" as reference, so to us it seem like system that not close to your "live performance" experiences is incorrect. but, do you know how much different is New york Carnegie Hall,Boston Symphony Hall,Vienna Musikverein hall,Berlin Berliner Philharmonie, Petronas Concert Hall, Singapore Esplanade??? And what about Pop and Rock concert that have totally different ambient and atmosphere??"
-Hv you been to this places? So tell me what do you use to gauge yr system's capability? Have you heard a Zildjian cymbal, Fender guitars etc in real live? Like I said if you cannot get an instrument to sound correctly in yr system "like live", it is simply because it is incapable of doing so! If yr system makes a Fender sound like a Dobro, would you say that it is correct? And would you just say I like this sound even though it is not correct?
"i think the explanations of the benefit of torquing is simple enought;resonance control."
"Hifikaki, I totally agree with you, even not using Torque screwdriver,just loosen the screw of the equipment we can make the tonal balance shift to warmer region,because the resonance frequency of the equipment is lower and it added into the music, and most audiophile will like that."
-You can just adjust yr speakers and the balance can shift to warmer or brighter balance, if you know how. You can use a cable to change the tonal balance of yr system. Do you mean this to be correct or you just like warm sound?
"It is nothing new if you have been in the Hi-Fi hobby long enough, check out those Hong Kong audiophile magazine 20/30 years ago they have lot of other tweaking method to play with resonance."
-I don't see you talking abt torquing esp when you said you knew abt it. Of course, there are other tweaking method. Can you show us or explain them?
"Using torque screwdriver will make the resonance more concentrated within a narrower frequency range, with usually is a good thing, but telling us torquing will "maximise the performance of a system??" come more lah, its only one of the countless voicing method in my humble opinion, particularly if the equipment have USED FOR SOMETIME"
-Like I said earlier, pls show or explain other good tweaks. It is no point saying that other exist when you cannot tell us abt it. If you read Hifikaki's post, you will clearly see that it has benefited his system. Why don't you acknowledge this?
"Thank you for your offer, I have heard some of the systems Torque by Jeff Lim already, and I have to say the improvement is obvious. What I disagree is the way you guys describe the tweak, make us feel like its the only ultimate tweak in audiophile circle, no other tweak can compare to it, and all other tweak have to look upon it, only tweak that match with the sound after Torque is good product/method. I hope while promoting your tweaking method, please respect other tweaking theory and method at the same time."
-I can't understand yr rationale. In one way, you acknowledge that torquing works when you hear it, but in other instances, you do not want to do so and you repeatedly state that we need to respect other forms of tweaking. And all the while you are just saying that other tweaks work without sharing anything? How do you expect people to accept what you say with any credibility? Not to mention that you hide behind a pseudonym, not telling us who you are? There is no credibility at all in what you say? Furthermore,
1.When did we say that the other tweak doesn't work?
2.Did we mention that torquing is the only tweak?
3.Did we ask audiophiles to forget abt using other methods of tweaking?
4.If we find some tweaks are not working in a system, should we just shut up and not share the info with the owner?
"Not only Telos guys know how to listen and what is good sound, everyone listen HiFi differently, and for this tweaking thing"
-You have repeatedly state that other tweaks but I hv not seen you explain any of them. I never said that I am the only one who knows how to listen. So when ML says that Stage III is great sounding, so can we tell him that he does not know how to listen to Audioquest or Kubala Sosna? If Panzer and ML finds great improvement with Torus conditioner, could we say that they should learn how to listen with other conditioners?
Personally I don't see a point of you going on and on abt other tweaks but you never care to explain them. As the Americans would say "Where's the Beef"?
"every road is leading to Rome."
-All roads lead to Rome was used when Rome was the pinnacle of civilisation. But that was more than 2 thousand yrs ago. Now Rome is not the top anymore, so should we still use this as a guide. Hell, people don't like to watch Italian league anymore, they prefer EPL. If the sound was great 20 yrs ago, it is probably not the top now. If that sound is still the top, then all the latest hardware with new technology are hopeless!
I try this Torque screwdriver tweak before. Yes this is cheap & effective tweak. Even your can screw the power cord & power distributor , especially diy one to get another improvement, not only equipment & loudspeaker. But this tweak is not as power as some branded like Harmonic ,Finite Elemente resonance control accessorizes, but more neutral less characteristic. Torque tweak + harmonix combination still bring me better sound. SO torque is better than untorque. Resonances be more control is better than less control. Torque screwdriver tweak is like tone contol, everyone got different taste, so be patient to get best result. If you don't like just loose it.
I try torquing tweak & love the effect. It may not as musical as some big brand like harmonix & Finite Elemente, but neutral & less characteristic. The most important this tweak is free & cheap. Especially in system without any resonance control accessorizes, this tweak will bring you big surprise. Even I am using many harmonix tweak, torquing tweak still give me better sound. So resonance be more control better than less control. Be careful, torquing tweak different value got different tone, so be patient to find out the best value.If you really dont like it just loose it, simple. Same as Harmonix & Finite Elemente item, different system must using correct combination, thick sound system not recommended use harmonix RF999, light equipment not recommended use cerabase.
YY,
"If you don't like just loose it."
Exactly my sentiment. As torquing and Harmonix work for you, torquing and Telos work for me and KC.
Can you please explain which Harmonix tweak you are using and what sound you have obtained?
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